Elon Musk takes his ball and goes home

[ZoWie]

The SpaceX contribution was to commercialize what had been developed by government contract for balance of power purposes. Musk did a good job of that, but now NASA has its own commercial crew program, and there is a general evolution toward non-military uses of space technology. Boeing has a space program now, and if that company wasn't run by bean counters and dunderheads, maybe it would amount to something besides embarrassing headlines.

The next big problem is going to be the amount of metal orbiting around the Earth. It's already killed off optical astronomy from the ground, and there are theories (as yet unverified) that it actually endangers life on Earth.

[ap215]

Philly DA sues to halt Elon Musk’s $1 million voter giveaway in Pennsylvania

Philadelphia District Attorney Larry Krasner on Monday sued to halt Elon Musk’s $1 million daily giveaway to voters in battleground states including Pennsylvania, calling it an illegal lottery that skirts state requirements and violates consumer protection laws.

The suit, filed in Common Pleas Court in Philadelphia, is the first legal action challenging the controversial sweepstakes launched earlier this month by Musk’s America PAC. It comes a week after the U.S. Justice Department warned the tech billionaire that the giveaway violates federal laws banning inducements to voters.

https://www.inquirer.com/politics/elect ... ter#loaded

[JoeMemphis]

Look Joe, here’s my full original post that caused all you guys to go full Godwin and Nazi.



What is there in the post that you have an argument with?

I didn’t have an issue with that post. You just went off the deep end thereafter.

[gounion]

I didn’t have an issue with that post. You just went off the deep end thereafter.

No GG did. Full Nazi. There was no reason for it, now, was there?

[JoeMemphis]

No GG did. Full Nazi. There was no reason for it, now, was there?

I’m betting we can spend another day or two discussing whether or not GG and Glenn are actually closet members of the Fourth Reich.

[gounion]

I’m betting we can spend another day or two discussing whether or not GG and Glenn are actually closet members of the Fourth Reich.

Look, there was NOTHING in my post that required ANYONE to start saying how important Nazis were, now, was there? But GG went there, and you chimed in on his side and went full Godwin yourself.

You SHOULD have pointed out to GG that Nazis had NOTHING to do with the discussion, and to retract it and move on. But no, you defended his and Glenn's rantings, and tried to blame it all on me.

You guys are just plain stupid. All of you.

[JoeMemphis]

Look, there was NOTHING in my post that required ANYONE to start saying how important Nazis were, now, was there? But GG went there, and you chimed in on his side and went full Godwin yourself.

You SHOULD have pointed out to GG that Nazis had NOTHING to do with the discussion, and to retract it and move on. But no, you defended his and Glenn's rantings, and tried to blame it all on me.

You guys are just plain stupid. All of you.

Plain stupid. Coming from you that’s rich.

We should be able to discuss history without calling or implying one or the other is a Nazi,Communist, Facist, bigot, etc etc etc. we should be able to discuss history on a discussion board. Current issues as well. It used to be that being called a racist, Nazi, bigot, confederate, traitor was a real slur. Now it means nothing. It’s been used sooo much it has lost all meaning. It’s devalued. It’s just another word. A meaningless insult.

You can dwell on it all you want. We can go on and on if you like and it won’t change. You may think Glenn or GG are closet Nazis. They aren’t. Nothing you say makes it so. I wonder why you insist on doing it. What do you hope to accomplish?

[gounion]

Plain stupid. Coming from you that’s rich.

We should be able to discuss history without calling or implying one or the other is a Nazi,Communist, Facist, bigot, etc etc etc. we should be able to discuss history on a discussion board. Current issues as well. It used to be that being called a racist, Nazi, bigot, confederate, traitor was a real slur. Now it means nothing. It’s been used sooo much it has lost all meaning. It’s devalued. It’s just another word. A meaningless insult.

You can dwell on it all you want. We can go on and on if you like and it won’t change. You may think Glenn or GG are closet Nazis. They aren’t. Nothing you say makes it so. I wonder why you insist on doing it. What do you hope to accomplish?

As usual, you are lying. I didn’t call anyone a Nazi. I called out their language, and their view that we owe Nazis for our space program.

You just keep dancing around, ignoring the obvious - all of you kept telling us on this thread how big a deal it was that “Nazi” - not Germans, but Nazis - are responsible for our space program.

And you accusing me of calling anyone a Nazi is - guess what - stupid.

[JoeMemphis]

As usual, you are lying. I didn’t call anyone a Nazi. I called out their language, and their view that we owe Nazis for our space program.

You just keep dancing around, ignoring the obvious - “all of you kept telling us on this thread how big a deal it was that “Nazi” - not Germans, but Nazis - are responsible for our space program.”

And you accusing me of calling anyone a Nazi is - guess what - stupid.

I said calling or implying. Once again a reading comprehension failure on your part. What are you implying when you dishonestly say all of you kept telling us on this thread how big a deal it was that “Nazi” - not Germans, but Nazis - are responsible for our space program. For one thing, I never said that. Did those scientist make major contributions to our programs. I would say yes. You may disagree. Are you implying that pointing out that fact means I have Nazi sympathies. You have gone on and on about it. So what exactly are you getting at? What has the last 4 or 5 pages been all about? Especially after both GG and Glenn have offered clarification. You continue to insist that isn’t good enough for you.

[Greengrass]

Plain stupid. Coming from you that’s rich.

We should be able to discuss history without calling or implying one or the other is a Nazi,Communist, Facist, bigot, etc etc etc. we should be able to discuss history on a discussion board. Current issues as well. It used to be that being called a racist, Nazi, bigot, confederate, traitor was a real slur. Now it means nothing. It’s been used sooo much it has lost all meaning. It’s devalued. It’s just another word. A meaningless insult.

You can dwell on it all you want. We can go on and on if you like and it won’t change. You may think Glenn or GG are closet Nazis. They aren’t. Nothing you say makes it so. I wonder why you insist on doing it. What do you hope to accomplish?

Von Braun was an SS officer. So I’m pretty sure calling him a nazi is a legit description.

[JoeMemphis]

Von Braun was an SS officer. So I’m pretty sure calling him a nazi is a legit description.

I don’t disagree. Hard to say why he did what he did. Only he can say. We do know what he contributed to rocket science and to the US programs. That shouldn’t and doesn’t IMV diminish the contribution and credit for the overall success which rightly belongs to the US.

[gounion]

I said calling or implying. Once again a reading comprehension failure on your part. What are you implying when you dishonestly say all of you kept telling us on this thread how big a deal it was that “Nazi” - not Germans, but Nazis - are responsible for our space program. For one thing, I never said that. Did those scientist make major contributions to our programs. I would say yes. You may disagree. Are you implying that pointing out that fact means I have Nazi sympathies. You have gone on and on about it. So what exactly are you getting at? What has the last 4 or 5 pages been all about? Especially after both GG and Glenn have offered clarification. You continue to insist that isn’t good enough for you.

I didn’t imply anyone was a Nazi. I implied nothing, except that all three of you doubled down on stupid, idiotic assertions using Nazis to argue with a perfectly valid post that I made, that you have no argument with as to the truthfulness of the post. Please - you’re demanding proof from ME on another thread, so haul out YOUR proof.

I can’t believe you guys just kept it up. You couldn’t help yourselves, even though every one of your assertions were stupid as hell. You just had to keep using Nazi, instead of switching to “Germans” instead - why is that, Joe? I’d love to hear your explanation.

Has nothing to do with whether you have Nazi sympathies or not. You don’t.

Having said that, there are a LOT of neo-Nazis that are voting like you are. They showed that yesterday in New York. Too bad you won’t speak out against them.

[gounion]

I don’t disagree. Hard to say why he did what he did. Only he can say. We do know what he contributed to rocket science and to the US programs. That shouldn’t and doesn’t IMV diminish the contribution and credit for the overall success which rightly belongs to the US.

“German Scientist” would have been more reasonable, but then, I’m not a big Nazi guy.

GG just wanted to try to argue with what I said - which you’ve admitted was completely reasonable, and there was no reason at all for GG to make such an assertion.

[JoeMemphis]

I didn’t imply anyone was a Nazi. I implied nothing, except that all three of you doubled down on stupid, idiotic assertions using Nazis to argue with a perfectly valid post that I made, that you have no argument with as to the truthfulness of the post. Please - you’re demanding proof from ME on another thread, so haul out YOUR proof.

I can’t believe you guys just kept it up. You couldn’t help yourselves, even though every one of your assertions were stupid as hell. You just had to keep using Nazi, instead of switching to “Germans” instead - why is that, Joe? I’d love to hear your explanation.

Has nothing to do with whether you have Nazi sympathies or not. You don’t.

Having said that, there are a LOT of neo-Nazis that are voting like you are. They showed that yesterday in New York. Too bad you won’t speak out against them.

What is it you want me to prove? Exactly.

Also explain the implication of your last sentence.

[gounion]

What is it you want me to prove? Exactly.

You accused me of calling or implying people have Nazi sympathies. Prove it or retract it.

The name-calling is Glenn calling all us liberals socialists and communists. I took exception to your assertions about our space program, while all I was doing was praising the President, the American scientists, physicists and engineers that put us on the moon, people like Katherine Johnson.

Why is it NONE OF YOU agreed with me, while continuing to make the case for “Nazis”? You STILL want to make a big deal out of their contributions, ignoring what our nation and citizens did.

[JoeMemphis]

You accused me of calling or implying people have Nazi sympathies. Prove it or retract it.

The name-calling is Glenn calling all us liberals socialists and communists. I took exception to your assertions about our space program, while all I was doing was praising the President, the American scientists, physicists and engineers that put us on the moon, people like Katherine Johnson.

Why is it NONE OF YOU agreed with me, while continuing to make the case for “Nazis”? You STILL want to make a big deal out of their contributions, ignoring what our nation and citizens did.

I don’t know that anyone disagreed with you. Maybe you can show that post.

And please explain the implication of your statement. “ Having said that, there are a LOT of neo-Nazis that are voting like you are. They showed that yesterday in New York. Too bad you won’t speak out against them.”

[Glennfs]

You accused me of calling or implying people have Nazi sympathies. Prove it or retract it.

The name-calling is Glenn calling all us liberals socialists and communists. I took exception to your assertions about our space program, while all I was doing was praising the President, the American scientists, physicists and engineers that put us on the moon, people like Katherine Johnson.

Why is it NONE OF YOU agreed with me, while continuing to make the case for “Nazis”? You STILL want to make a big deal out of their contributions, ignoring what our nation and citizens did.

Why do you keep saying I call all you liberals socialist and communists when it isn't true?

[gounion]

I don’t know that anyone disagreed with you. Maybe you can show that post.

You all just continually ignored my pointing that out, while telling us how damned important that the Nazis were.

And please explain the implication of your statement. “ Having said that, there are a LOT of neo-Nazis that are voting like you are. They showed that yesterday in New York. Too bad you won’t speak out against them.”

The implication is that there are a LOT of neo-Nazis on the right, and you guys are silent about all of them, just like you’re silent on Glenn’s post about the hate and racism in Trump’s rally yesterday.

Any question? One from me - why are you so silent about them?

[Glennfs]

Why do you keep saying I call all you liberals socialist and communists when it isn't true?

Draws list was totally out of context. No there are no commies here, however I do believe Bernie Sanders is a communist at heart.

There could be some socialist but most of them don't realize that democratic socialism is simply socialism with a new label.

[gounion]

Draws list was totally out of context. No there are no commies here, however I do believe Bernie Sanders is a communist at heart.

There could be some socialist but most of them don't realize that democratic socialism is simply socialism with a new label.

You’ve called all liberals communists, and many of us in particular. You can’t count the number of times you’ve called me “Comrade”.

You can dish it out but you can’t take it.

No, you have never had ANY clue what socialism REALLY is. By YOUR views, YOU are a socialist because you support single payer health care.

[Glennfs]

You’ve called all liberals communists, and many of us in particular. You can’t count the number of times you’ve called me “Comrade”.

You can dish it out but you can’t take it.

No, you have never had ANY clue what socialism REALLY is. By YOUR views, YOU are a socialist because you support single payer health care.

Again let's not have a flame war. Almost every time was a sarcastic remark about something you were saying at the time. Which drak conveniently didn't mention

In my opinion anyone who doesn't recognize that democratic socialism is just socialism rebranded doesn't have a clue as to what socialism is.

If you consider supporting supporting one social program means you support all social programs you need to rethink that.

[JoeMemphis]

You all just continually ignored my pointing that out, while telling us how damned important that the Nazis were.

The implication is that there are a LOT of neo-Nazis on the right, and you guys are silent about all of them, just like you’re silent on Glenn’s post about the hate and racism in Trump’s rally yesterday.

Any question? One from me - why are you so silent about them?

So nobody “disagreed” with your point otherwise you would have pointed to it.

I know what you said. Why do you think I need to post about something said at a Trump rally? Harris had rally’s last week. I didn’t comment on them. Waltz had rallies last week. I didn’t comment on them. Vance had rallies last week. I didn’t comment on them. So why do you think I need to comment on Trump rallies?

For one thing, I didn’t watch any rallies from either party last week. Not my thing. I’m not voting for either candidate so why would Inwatch their rallies. Last night I watched the Dallas game and enjoyed it. I also didn’t comment on that. So why do I need to comment on something that obviously bothered you which was supposedly said at a rally I didn’t watch.

Explain that to me. Why ask the question in the first place unless you were implying that I somehow support the neo Nazi point of view. Now who is going full Godwin?

[gounion]

So nobody “disagreed” with your point otherwise you would have pointed to it.

Nah, you ignored the points praising our nation. The MORE important points, to all of you, seemed to be that Nazis were involved, and somehow, they needed praise. That astonishes me.

Why the fuck would you do that?

I know what you said. Why do you think I need to post about something said at a Trump rally? Harris had rally’s last week. I didn’t comment on them. Waltz had rallies last week. I didn’t comment on them. Vance had rallies last week. I didn’t comment on them. So why do you think I need to comment on Trump rallies?

For one thing, I didn’t watch any rallies from either party last week. Not my thing. I’m not voting for either candidate so why would Inwatch their rallies. Last night I watched the Dallas game and enjoyed it. I also didn’t comment on that. So why do I need to comment on something that obviously bothered you which was supposedly said at a rally I didn’t watch.

Explain that to me. Why ask the question in the first place unless you were implying that I somehow support the neo Nazi point of view. Now who is going full Godwin?

You attack the liberal point of view. But you can have someone who says if he wins he's going to call out the military on his enemies. That Puerto Rico is a floating pile of garbage.

You're just dancing, Joe. You know I didn't call any of you Nazis or Nazi sympathizers. So now you're making accusations of "insinuations" and trying to stretch questions about specific people doing specific things into "insinuations".

It's really laughable.

What we do have is you guys swearing thread after thread that Nazis - not Germans, but NAZIS - were the most damned important thing about our space program, and ignoring what the American government and the American people did. Couldn't even get you all to comment in on it for pages, and even after that, it was only YOU that admitted anything at all about ANYONE but Nazis having any credit for our program.

Now, explain THAT to me, Joe. Why was that so damned important to all of you? Why the FUCK was it brought up in the first place, and why did you all climb aboard?

[JoeMemphis]

Nah, you ignored the points praising our nation. The MORE important points, to all of you, seemed to be that Nazis were involved, and somehow, they needed praise. That astonishes me.

Why the fuck would you do that?
You attack the liberal point of view. But you can have someone who says if he wins he's going to call out the military on his enemies. That Puerto Rico is a floating pile of garbage.

You're just dancing, Joe. You know I didn't call any of you Nazis or Nazi sympathizers. So now you're making accusations of "insinuations" and trying to stretch questions about specific people doing specific things into "insinuations".

It's really laughable.

What we do have is you guys swearing thread after thread that Nazis - not Germans, but NAZIS - were the most damned important thing about our space program, and ignoring what the American government and the American people did. Couldn't even get you all to comment in on it for pages, and even after that, it was only YOU that admitted anything at all about ANYONE but Nazis having any credit for our program.

Now, explain THAT to me, Joe. Why was that so damned important to all of you? Why the FUCK was it brought up in the first place, and why did you all climb aboard?

Nobody disagreed with you. Nobody. You claimed we did but yet you can’t point to the post to back that up. So you are whining. Unnecessarily.

Further nobody said that Nazis deserved all the credit or any of that other crap you allege. Nobody said it was the “damned most important thing”. If they did then point to the post.

Lastly, you insinuate or imply that unless we comment negatively on something or disavow something we support or agree. Silence is not agreement especially when it’s a rally we don’t attend or watch. You do that shit all the time and we all know why you do it. You can deny it but it’s obvious to anyone who reads above a fifth grade level. You are fooling no one.

[gounion]

Nobody disagreed with you. Nobody. You claimed we did but yet you can’t point to the post to back that up. So you are whining. Unnecessarily.

Further nobody said that Nazis deserved all the credit or any of that other crap you allege. Nobody said it was the “damned most important thing”. If they did then point to the post.

Lastly, you insinuate or imply that unless we comment negatively on something or disavow something we support or agree. Silence is not agreement especially when it’s a rally we don’t attend or watch. You do that shit all the time and we all know why you do it. You can deny it but it’s obvious to anyone who reads above a fifth grade level. You are fooling no one.

If they weren’t so damned important, why did you continue to go on and on about how damned important they were - and it was important that they were NAZIS not Germans.

Those are your posts as well as GreenGrass and Glenn’s. It wasn’t my fault you kept it up. Take responsibility for your own actions.

And you know I never insinuated or implied anything - and we all know it. First you said I CALLED people Nazis, now you’ve pissed backwards on that one. It’s hilarious.