Mormon child molestation hotline.

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gounion
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Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by gounion »

Glenn likes to manufacture outrage. Pretend to be very upset by some perceived bullshit Drudge tells him to be upset about.

But you want OUTRAGE? I've got OUTRAGE over this:
MJ was a tiny, black-haired girl, just 5 years old, when her father admitted to his bishop that he was sexually abusing her.

The father, a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and an admitted pornography addict, was in counseling with his bishop when he revealed the abuse. The bishop, who was also a family physician, followed church policy and called what church officials have dubbed the “help line” for guidance.

But the call offered little help for MJ. Lawyers for the church, widely known as the Mormon church, who staff the help line around the clock told Bishop John Herrod not to call police or child welfare officials. Instead he kept the abuse secret.

“They said, ‘You absolutely can do nothing,’” Herrod said in a recorded interview with law enforcement.

Herrod continued to counsel MJ’s father, Paul Douglas Adams, for another year, and brought in Adams’ wife, Leizza Adams, in hopes she would do something to protect the children. She didn’t. Herrod later told a second bishop, who also kept the matter secret after consulting with church officials who maintain that the bishops were excused from reporting the abuse to police under the state’s so-called clergy-penitent privilege.

Adams continued raping MJ for as many as seven more years, into her adolescence, and also abused her infant sister, who was born during that time. He frequently recorded the abuse on video and posted the video on the internet.

Adams was finally arrested by Homeland Security agents in 2017 with no help from the church, after law enforcement officials in New Zealand discovered one of the videos. He died by suicide in custody before he could stand trial.

The Associated Press has obtained nearly 12,000 pages of sealed records from an unrelated child sex abuse lawsuit against the Mormon church in West Virginia. The documents offer the most detailed and comprehensive look yet at the so-called help line Herrod called. Families of survivors who filed the lawsuit said they show it’s part of a system that can easily be misused by church leaders to divert abuse accusations away from law enforcement and instead to church attorneys who may bury the problem, leaving victims in harm’s way.

The help line has been criticized by abuse victims and their attorneys for being inadequate to quickly stop abuse and protect victims. Yet the Utah-based faith has stuck by the system despite the criticism and increasing scrutiny from attorneys and prosecutors, including those in the Adams case.

“‘I just think that the Mormon church really sucks. Seriously sucks,” said MJ, who is now 16, during an interview with the AP. “They are just the worst type of people, from what I’ve experienced and what other people have also experienced.”
This wasn't just a one-off. It's how the church handles these things. This is church doctrine from the top.

Anyone care to explain why these leaders and lawyers shouldn't be in a fucking prison?

Religion poisons everything.
Glennfs
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by Glennfs »

If that is illegal those lawyers should be charged with crimes
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gounion
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by gounion »

Glennfs wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 12:47 pm If that is illegal those lawyers should be charged with crimes
So you're saying if it's not illegal it's just fine?

Wow talk about moral relativism.

You support the Mormon church letting molesters go free. Got it.
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ProfX
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by ProfX »

I don't care whether it's a church, a social club, or the international house of pancakes.

Child abuse and molestation is a crime. Failure to report a crime you are aware of, and further protecting and relocating the offenders, is also a crime.

Would be true of the Catholic Church, Mormon Church, or the Loyal Order of Water Buffaloes.
"Don't believe every quote attributed to people on the Internet" -- Abraham Lincoln :D
gounion
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by gounion »

ProfX wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 2:13 pm I don't care whether it's a church, a social club, or the international house of pancakes.

Child abuse and molestation is a crime. Failure to report a crime you are aware of, and further protecting and relocating the offenders, is also a crime.

Would be true of the Catholic Church, Mormon Church, or the Loyal Order of Water Buffaloes.
Glenn stands up for this vile practice.
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carmenjonze
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by carmenjonze »

Glennfs wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 12:47 pm If that is illegal those lawyers should be charged with crimes
Is it illegal to be unethical?
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carmenjonze
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by carmenjonze »

gounion wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:24 am Glenn likes to manufacture outrage. Pretend to be very upset by some perceived bullshit Drudge tells him to be upset about.

But you want OUTRAGE? I've got OUTRAGE over this:



This wasn't just a one-off. It's how the church handles these things. This is church doctrine from the top.

Anyone care to explain why these leaders and lawyers shouldn't be in a fucking prison?

Religion poisons everything.
Religion does not poison everything. Conservatism poisons everything. Conservative religion is destructive and deadly. This story is a very clear case in point.
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gounion
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by gounion »

carmenjonze wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 4:43 pm Religion does not poison everything. Conservatism poisons everything. Conservative religion is destructive and deadly. This story is a very clear case in point.
Sorry, but I'm tired of seeing every religion back child molesters. The Bible is a book of myths having nothing to do with reality, and it's done nothing but poison our societies around the world, along with that other book of myths, the Koran.
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carmenjonze
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by carmenjonze »

gounion wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 4:46 pm Sorry, but I'm tired of seeing every religion back child molesters.
Every religion does not back child molesters, unless you’re trying to claim the most obnoxious religions in the US are “religion.”
The Bible is a book of myths having nothing to do with reality, and it's done nothing but poison our societies around the world, along with that other book of myths, the Koran.
Better turn off Disney+ when the MCU comes on, then. :p
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Libertas
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by Libertas »

I lean toward religion in general being bad for humans, but then I think of a tv show in Canada called "Little Mosque On The Prairie."

I know it is just a TV show, but it gave me a whole new way of seeing Muslims and their religion in a positive way. The Women being treated like 2nd class citizens exists and bothers me but when it came up on the show the lead Woman Muslim who was also an MD, made me think twice.

IDK, I wish religion or faith could be a net positive because while there is no such thing as a god, of course, there is something we dont know about yet given we are a pretty dumb, young species...

(I did not have a negative view of Muslims before the show, but I had little knowledge of their ways like most Americans.)
I sigh in your general direction.
gounion
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by gounion »

carmenjonze wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 4:52 pm Every religion does not back child molesters, unless you’re trying to claim the most obnoxious religions in the US are “religion.”
All the major Bible-backed religions pretty much do.
Better turn off Disney+ when the MCU comes on, then. :p
Here's the thing: The MCU is fantasy, just like the Bible. Of course, there's some crazed individuals who believe there really is an Earth 616.

Myths can be important, as they can teach great lessons - but we have to understand that myths is all they are. But the Bible myths teach us to hate, not to love.
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by Glennfs »

carmenjonze wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 4:42 pm Is it illegal to be unethical?
Sometimes
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Glennfs
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by Glennfs »

gounion wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 2:03 pm So you're saying if it's not illegal it's just fine?

Wow talk about moral relativism.

You support the Mormon church letting molesters go free. Got it.
I don't know and neither do you.
I am a trucker and you a retired union officer.
I would hope that it is but again neither of us know for sure.
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gounion
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by gounion »

Glennfs wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 6:00 pm I don't know and neither do you.
I am a trucker and you a retired union officer.
I would hope that it is but again neither of us knew for sure.
Sorry, I KNOW that child molestation is one of the very worst things that can be done, and anyone who covers it up and allows molestation can continue, should be in prison for the rest of their lives.

But I guess you're on the other side on this.
Glennfs
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by Glennfs »

gounion wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 6:02 pm Sorry, I KNOW that child molestation is one of the very worst things that can be done, and anyone who covers it up and allows molestation can continue, should be in prison for the rest of their lives.

But I guess you're on the other side on this.
As you know what I was saying is if it is illegal for the church lawyers to act in the fashion described in the link they should be prosecuted.
What we do not know is if it is illegal or not.
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gounion
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by gounion »

Glennfs wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 6:06 pm As you know what I was saying is if it is illegal for the church lawyers to act in the fashion described in the link they should be prosecuted.
What we do not know is if it is illegal or not.
It should be as illegal as all get out, shouldn't it?

How can covering up decades of child molestation be legal?

It's funny how you defend this, no outrage at all. Just kids after all, right?
Glennfs
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by Glennfs »

gounion wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 6:09 pm It should be as illegal as all get out, shouldn't it?

How can covering up decades of child molestation be legal?

It's funny how you defend this, no outrage at all. Just kids after all, right?
Of course it should be illegal and hopefully it is. I haven't defended anything as for outrage I was replying with ideas not emotions. Of course I as well as any rational person would be outraged.
Did you post this for discussion or just as a way to bad mouth religion
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gounion
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by gounion »

Glennfs wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 6:12 pm Of course it should be illegal and hopefully it is. I haven't defended anything as for outrage I was replying with ideas not emotions. Of course I as well as any rational person would be outraged.
Did you post this for discussion or just as a way to bad mouth religion
But you aren't outraged. You save that for whatever Drudge tells you the left is doing to be outraged about.

This is REAL, Glenn, and untold numbers of children have been victimized. Not something to be very rational about.
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ProfX
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by ProfX »

Glennfs wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 6:06 pm What we do not know is if it is illegal or not.
While state laws may vary, this is Florida's.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/ind ... 9.205.html

(1) A person who knowingly and willfully fails to report to the central abuse hotline known or suspected child abuse, abandonment, or neglect, or who knowingly and willfully prevents another person from doing so, commits a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084.

[snip][end]

I believe at least 30 or so other states have similar laws.
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carmenjonze
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Re: Mormon sex abuse hotline.

Post by carmenjonze »

Glennfs wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 5:58 pmSometimes
Says the guy who thinks sex with a 15 year old at age 18 is a good idea.
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carmenjonze
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by carmenjonze »

gounion wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 5:01 pm All the major Bible-backed religions pretty much do.
No, they do not.

"Bible-backed religions" are just a drop in the bucket of what religion is.

Here's the thing: The MCU is fantasy, just like the Bible. Of course, there's some crazed individuals who believe there really is an Earth 616.

Myths can be important, as they can teach great lessons - but we have to understand that myths is all they are. But the Bible myths teach us to hate, not to love.
:? Bible myths do not teach us to hate.

Millions and millions of people indeed pick and choose stories from the Bible to justify and rationalize their hatreds. Bible myths don't teach us to hate any more than Norse myths or Hindu myths or Native American myths or secular myths, some of which have resulted in the deaths of yet more millions. "Religion" is not limited to hate-based Christianity and Islam.
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The way to right wrongs is to
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~ Ida B. Wells
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gounion
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by gounion »

carmenjonze wrote: Sun Aug 07, 2022 10:02 pm No, they do not.

"Bible-backed religions" are just a drop in the bucket of what religion is.



:? Bible myths do not teach us to hate.

Millions and millions of people indeed pick and choose stories from the Bible to justify and rationalize their hatreds. Bible myths don't teach us to hate any more than Norse myths or Hindu myths or Native American myths or secular myths, some of which have resulted in the deaths of yet more millions. "Religion" is not limited to hate-based Christianity and Islam.
The Bible teaches us to hate. I can just point to the pro-slavery parts, AND the kill-the-gays part.
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by Glennfs »

gounion wrote: Mon Aug 08, 2022 10:11 am The Bible teaches us to hate. I can just point to the pro-slavery parts, AND the kill-the-gays part.
The fact is you hate religion especially christianity. There are close to 400,000 churches in the USA.
The only thing you are going to see in the news is the bad apples. Because the millions of people whose life has been turned around by religion is not news and we will never hear about.
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ProfX
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by ProfX »

The Bible is one of the most terribly misinterpreted documents. It's constantly prooftexted and misinterpreted, largely by people who are uninterested in the context of passages.

That's really aside from what this thread is about, though.

Heck, the Mormons only barely use it. They prefer their 19th century fiction the Book of Mormon. :D

Unfortunately, child abuse and coverups are also occurring in other secular institutions, like scouting, K-12 education :| , and most horribly, things that call themselves child welfare organizations. Seems there are scum throughout society who like the trust of and access to children, and abuse that trust.

Wherever that's happening, it's bad.
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carmenjonze
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Re: Mormon child molestation hotline.

Post by carmenjonze »

gounion wrote: Mon Aug 08, 2022 10:11 am The Bible teaches us to hate.
No, it does not.
I can just point to the pro-slavery parts, AND the kill-the-gays part.
Okay well, fundamentalists and Evangelicals use this identitcal tactic. I know the tactic well, and can quote you exact chapters and verses regarding these and similar subjects.

But the tactic you're using is called prooftexting, also known as quote mining.

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Quote_mining

Were I interested in theological arguments, I could also very easily prooftext every mention in the Bible about loving your neighbor and other such things, but I've got nothing to prove about the Bible.

Point is, The Bible (and Koran) are by no means the only religious texts, and these problems you're talking about stem from conservative applications of "religion." Conservative Christianity and conservative Islam do not define "religion."

And no, every religion does not back child molesters. These are gross distortions of "religion."
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